Author Topic: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.  (Read 142223 times)

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Offline Nuruddeen

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #120 on: March 27, 2009, 08:35:51 PM »
Assalamu alaikum,
Private messages are for private businesses. The issue at hand concern all of us NOT you alone- personalising a discussion is, I presume, what could be part of the reason why we have on so many occasions hot exchanges between members, when issuses are ascribed to individuals.

Beside by seeing the contributions as they are made could afford us to read and make comments, etc.

I hope am right Mr. Chairman of KNLine (Danbarno) you are the BOSS.

EMTL,

Private messages can be for private businesses as much as they can be for discussing solution based public issues. The most important thing is for one to know exactly when a PM is for personal or public issue.

Personally I don't think there is need for forming a committee if the committee do not have basis for meeting and discussing issues of its mandate and reporting to the umbrella organization or group.

The point is the committee must report back its conclusions that the audience may debate on it.

I think this is how things are done anywhere in the world.

Finally, I think I have almost a decade of experience in public discourses as much as I know that hot exchanges are normal occurrences  just as conflicts in marriages or relationships. They are part of this adventure we call life. But then how one takes the hot exchange is what counts and indicates whether one is mature enough or not.

This is what a commonly experienced gentleman who understands the dynamics of living should be familiar with.

I think the fact that I will  HOTLY agree with my co-discussants today and HOTLY disagree with them tomorrow shouldn't make a gentleman think he has to constantly refer to others as seemingly intolerant persons. That will not speak well of s a gentleman even in the eyes of those he might, in life, be seeking to desperately impress.

But then if others here think this discussion shouldn't go among the members of the committee exclusively then I think the idea of forming a committee from the onset is irrelevant. So nobody should go with the name or label of Secretary of the Committee or Chairman or any other for the committee.

Still should many among us here think and believe I am making things personal, I think this is a public space. I only thought I can contribute and it is why I am here. I know also I can contribute even outside the membership of any committee.

So you can strip me off of my membership of this commitee, that I may not personalise things. And I'll still try to keep contributing.


[ b]
Waziri[/b]


Salam,

I think it is imperative for us to know that holding unnecessary grouse will never help matters. Of course, there is no gain debating on private or public messaging here. What really matter is the issue at stake. I reason along with both EMTL and Waziri. And I think they should not waste time dragging feet as to arriving at a coomon standpoint on the committee issue. Waziri should please kindly consider his position as the secretary and forge ahead. EMTL should as well get over the "PM" of a thing and let's progress to another level. Dan Barno has made so much tarciturnity on the issue of this Bazawari/ Bazawara stuff,and it will be good to give him the benefit of doubt over his DEBATE TO ACTION initiative. I remember, this was what was exactly agreed at the recent K-online gathering, to which thew Webmaster agreed and promised to come up with a special thread on it, but is up to today at large. That is why I do not think our honourable webmaster is helping matters in this regard.


Again, as Waziri said, I hope all the commmittee members will co-operate and work together by bringing this arduos task into fruition. The target given by Db, I think must be met. So we don't have time to waste anymore. Waziri and EMTL should go ahead and PM or Public meeasge whoever they want, but it does not matter to anyone of us here. That is their own cup of tea. As far as I am concerned, I am a member of the committee and in sha Allah I will discharge my duty diligently and effectively.

So let us put behind all our wrongs and save the Sunnah of our beloved prophet from being mishandled, misconceived and played with by majority of our people.


I therefore suggest that what we should do after deliberations, we shlould then submit our resolutions, recommendations and findings to approriate authorities for possible action. We shall in sha Allah come up with a communique that will be published in the natioanl dailies; signed by each member to show the whole world that we are serious.

I remain loyal.

Nura
o try and fail is atleast to learn. That will save one the inestimable loss of what might have been (positive or negative).

Offline Dan-Borno

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #121 on: March 27, 2009, 10:26:19 PM »
for my record to go straight, the below still stands as the committee
on the debate to action on the issue of divorce in arewa.

1.  Ummita to serve as chairperson of the committee
2.  Nura Jibo - member
3.  Bee  -  Member
4.  Bakangizo - Member
5.  IBB - member
6.  Waduz - member
7.  Waziri & Muhsin should serve as Secretary & Co-Secretary respectively

BELOW ARE THE TERMS OF REFERENCE AGAIN:

a.  to identify the immediate and remotre cause(s) of divorce in arewa
b.  profer solution to (a) above
c.  prepare a suitable document for presentation to all the northern states houses of assembly
    with a view of enacting a law that will reduce high rate of divorce (bazawara/bazawari) in arewa
d.  make other further recommendations as with regards to family life in arewa

You are hereby given up to July 31st, 2009 to submit your report for further action, please.

(SIGNED)
DAN-BORNO
INTERIM CHAIRMAN (DEBATE TO ACTION)
"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

Offline bakangizo

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #122 on: March 28, 2009, 11:51:40 AM »
i dont think it is necessary to waste so much energy on isssues that have
long been resolved amicably.  haba nura, you need to exercise patience and
be accomodating, aunty husnaa has gained so many respect in this forum
and whatever you deem fit she did it wrong she deserve some respect at
least for sticking with us alone as a lady amidst gentlemen.

Amma ai DB you should'nt blame nura. Lets be sincere, this friction is bound to happen. Nerves would naturally be jagged in this type of argument. Thats why I said gender-sentiment will always play a great part in this issue. Truth is, with all due respect, Husnaa has always been unnecessarily harsh towards men whenever issues like this come up. Gaskiya sometimes I wonder, 'why does she have this strong urge to castigate the menfolk?'. ;D :( We should try as much as possible to shun bias in this area. And we should be tolerant towards each other's views. Kaman 'yanuwa muke anan.

It is totally wrong and unacceptable to try and insist that men are the reason for our marital probs. It is equally wrong to insist only the women are to blame. It is a mixture of the sexes. We are all to blame. So why don't channel our energy toward identifying the whys and hows these probs come up, intead of futily trying to blame the opposite sex?
« Last Edit: March 28, 2009, 06:34:18 PM by Bakan~Gizo »

Offline EMTL

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #123 on: March 29, 2009, 02:54:33 PM »
for my record to go straight, the below still stands as the committee
on the debate to action on the issue of divorce in arewa.
BELOW ARE THE TERMS OF REFERENCE AGAIN: [/size]
a.  to identify the immediate and remotre cause(s) of divorce in arewa
b.  profer solution to (a) above
c.  prepare a suitable document for presentation to all the northern states houses of assembly with a view of enacting a law that will reduce high rate of divorce (bazawara/bazawari) in arewa
d.  make other further recommendations as with regards to family life in arewa

You are hereby given up to July 31st, 2009 to submit your report for further action, please.


Assalamu alaikum,
Mallam Dan barno, Points (a) & (b) are in order but have we anywhere agree to go to point (c)? prepare a suitable document for presentation to all the northern states houses of assembly with a view of enacting a law that will reduce high rate of divorce (bazawara/bazawari) in arewa

In the Affairs of People Fear Allah (SWT). In the Matters Relating to Allah (SWT) Do not be Afraid of Anybody. Ibn Katthab (RA).

Offline _Waziri_

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #124 on: March 30, 2009, 11:15:33 AM »
Assalamu alaikum,
Mallam Dan barno, Points (a) & (b) are in order but have we anywhere agree to go to point (c)? prepare a suitable document for presentation to all the northern states houses of assembly with a view of enacting a law that will reduce high rate of divorce (bazawara/bazawari) in arewa


Okay,

Engineer, you can make a case for or against that item for the consideration of your audience.

Thanks everybody for your contributions. This is a sign that we are recording progress.
Please let anybody with plausible argument against what we are doing or planning to do present their reasons and alternate plans of actions.

Waziri

Offline Dan-Borno

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #125 on: March 30, 2009, 01:19:43 PM »
Assalamu alaikum,
Mallam Dan barno, Points (a) & (b) are in order but have we anywhere agree to go to point (c)? prepare a suitable document for presentation to all the northern states houses of assembly with a view of enacting a law that will reduce high rate of divorce (bazawara/bazawari) in arewa

i think someone came up with an argument that except stringent laws
at-tahzir for people to get direction and get cautioned.  however as the
legendary said, if the house says there is no need to press our demands
to reach the various states houses of assembly, then we can concentrate
on only phamplets.

"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

Offline *~MuDa~*

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #126 on: March 30, 2009, 05:19:44 PM »
Kudos gentlemen, we are getting somewhere with this, the whole process is begining to take shape, but like EMTL, i also think the item (c) is kind of unrealistic interms of result orienting, even with a bill passed, the muslim majority will react on the grounds that we are trying to innovate man made law aside that of the Qur'an. What do you think?
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Offline bakangizo

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #127 on: March 30, 2009, 05:52:57 PM »
Kudos gentlemen, we are getting somewhere with this, the whole process is begining to take shape, but like EMTL, i also think the item (c) is kind of unrealistic interms of result orienting, even with a bill passed, the muslim majority will react on the grounds that we are trying to innovate man made law aside that of the Qur'an. What do you think?

I also thought item 'C' is gonna be a little tricky. First, what's the medium of presentation? Are we mailing our recommendations to the respective Houses, or we are making a physical presentation? How many states are we targeting? All, or a few for now? How serious are they gonna take it? If we must do this item 'c', why not create a lil' awareness first? Like maybe  get some support from other quarters, so that our recommendations may carry a little weight, and it won't just hit the Houses of Assembly out of the blue?

I'm not against this, but we need to think it out a lot. There's the possibility of ppl kicking against it (like goga said), but it all depends on what we recommend to be passed as law/bill.

Offline _Waziri_

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #128 on: March 31, 2009, 12:00:37 PM »
Kudos gentlemen, we are getting somewhere with this, the whole process is begining to take shape, but like EMTL, i also think the item (c) is kind of unrealistic interms of result orienting, even with a bill passed, the muslim majority will react on the grounds that we are trying to innovate man made law aside that of the Qur'an. What do you think?

I also thought item 'C' is gonna be a little tricky. First, what's the medium of presentation? Are we mailing our recommendations to the respective Houses, or we are making a physical presentation? How many states are we targeting? All, or a few for now? How serious are they gonna take it? If we must do this item 'c', why not create a lil' awareness first? Like maybe  get some support from other quarters, so that our recommendations may carry a little weight, and it won't just hit the Houses of Assembly out of the blue?

I'm not against this, but we need to think it out a lot. There's the possibility of ppl kicking against it (like goga said), but it all depends on what we recommend to be passed as law/bill.

Thanks BKZ,

I think you have a very good case in what you've said.

 I believe the target should be those Northern states with clear Muslim majority for now. Then the question of whether they will take it serious or not depends on the substance made in our submission.

I think we can seek supports from other quarters either. But then there are issues of mode of presentation as you observed. Perhaps we should think more about it.

Even then, I do not agree with Muda. I believe there is a religious basis for suggesting the kind of laws we are thinking of suggesting.

We also have to know that we are only making suggestions only and as such no state is under obligation to respond to our suggestion favorably. But I am sure we will be recalled in history as some who have tried the best they can in their own little ways.

But how do you see this?

Waziri


Offline waduz

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #129 on: March 31, 2009, 02:12:10 PM »
1. TO IDENTIFY THE IMMEDIATE AND REMOTE CAUSES OF DIVORCE:

a. Lack of understanding of the sacred institution of marriage.

It is disturbing that an average man or woman does not know the basic principles and importance of marriage itself. People hardly bother to know what are the rights of each of the spouses on the other. They only get married to satisfy lustful needs and along the way abandon it completely, or go for a new spouse.

b. Lack of restrain and patience among spouses.

The fact remains that only a few couples exercise restrain and abstain from pronouncing divorce after a minor scuffle. An incident that appear to be so simple and small, will be blown out of proportion, creating a mounting out of a mole hill. The issue is allowed to degenerate and ultimately the marriage is broken or crashed.

c. Lack of adequate care of wives by husbands.

One of the strong requirements of the Sunnah for marriages is that, the husband must shoulder all the responsibilities of his wife, especially feeding and "feeding." The husband must get for his wife what to eat. If for any reason the husband fails to satisfy her food reuirements, obviously, she must look for it, and that is where problems start.

d. Men marrying more than one wife.

This leverage is devine for men to marry up to four wives if they can be equitable to all of them. However, certain class of women tend to believe that they only are enough for their husbands and therefore they will never share a husband with any woman! This in itself leads to such women abandoning their marriage.

e. Unsatiable (bedside)

Where any of the parties cannot be adequate enough to the other, it sometimes leads to the breakup of the matrimony.

f. Unnecessary quarrels.

Some couples are always fighting one another to the dismay of neighbors. Some couples use to be so stormy that the family hardly progresses in all endeavors. The recalcitrant of the couples to accept peace and live harmoniously, results into break up.




Guys, I will continue later...

Offline *~MuDa~*

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #130 on: March 31, 2009, 11:02:48 PM »
kai waziri...lol. Whatever you say but i dont believe in going through all this stress just for the goal of being recognised in history as someone who attempted, i rather aim at being recognised in the books as someone who did it!
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Offline _Waziri_

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #131 on: April 01, 2009, 11:14:46 AM »
but i dont believe in going through all this stress just for the goal of being recognised in history as someone who attempted, i rather aim at being recognised in the books as someone who did it!

The funny thing about life is we don't know for sure when we will succeed and when we will fail. A task may look too difficult only for it to be conquered after constant trial. A task may look too easy only to prove unaccomplished after trial.

This is why Allah advises us to try when we are sure of the purity of our intentions as in this case. The result will never be a failure in the sight of God.

Those who don't understand the nature of the working of this world may find it easy to laugh at others when they try to thread a different path. But sometimes it rewards.


Waziri

Offline *~MuDa~*

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #132 on: April 10, 2009, 08:02:40 PM »
You are right Waziri (Ranka ya dade), that's why we have to strive to succeed not to strive to give a try only, this is really a serious business which will attract serious challenges from serious personalities, therefor we just have to be careful and do what we feel can be achievable. I know i wasnt here from the onset but i'm just saying this issue though it seems like a humurous problem it is also in all form a delicate, elaborate and intricate issue, people will definately raise alarm that we are trying to introduce a new thing from the norm, there will be enormous provocative challenges to face, so we have to be fully loaded and ready to act, with personalities like you, No shaking at all, we can make it.
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Offline Dan-Borno

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #133 on: April 22, 2009, 09:16:48 PM »
Ummita, Nura Jibo, Bee, Bakangizo, IBB, Waduz
Waziri & Muhsin i hope you are doing a very good
job because time is not on our side.


"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

Offline bakangizo

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Re: BAZAWARA/BAZAWARI ISSUES.
« Reply #134 on: May 31, 2009, 07:18:11 PM »
Ummita, Nura Jibo, Bee, Bakangizo, IBB, Waduz
Waziri & Muhsin i hope you are doing a very good
job because time is not on our side.

Iye? Na'am? ::)

 


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