Corrupt and fraudulent Governors

[Barde]

I know a large number of educted and thoroughly emancipated Moslem women and they would find your views very offensive.[/code]

Dave,
'Thoroughly emancipated'? you guys are not given Islam a fair treatment, you consider every bit of islamic injunction as old-fashined, violation of human rights etc, infact i consider the issue of the status of women in Islam as a worn-out propaganda against islam. Unfortunately, even some Muslims have become adversely affected by this falsehood and have begun to doubt the true Islam standpoint. I heard of some Muslims who are working tirelessly to 'modernized' some verses of the Qu'ran (waiyyazhubillah) on the ground that we've surpassed such an era.

Allah (SWT) has not given equality to man and woman as the 'Modernist societies' perceive it to be, but Has given equality to the difference in the creation,  Allah says, "Whosoever performs good deeds, Male or Female and is a believer, we shall surely grant him a peaceful and tranquil life, and we will certainly reward them for the best of what they did." And another Ayaat says, "And whosoever does deeds of righteousness, whether Male or Female, and is a believer, they will enter Heaven and not the least injustice will be done to them." Like i mentioned times without number, there are things binding on both parties and one of the things is for the wife to take charge of the home affairs, now tell me, how can she effectively discharge such a duty from her working place? she cannot be at her office and at the same time be in her house, if your companionship is silent over such duties, ours is entirely different. We also consider some of your attitudes as animalism but we neither condemn you nor impose our own belief over yours. True islamic teaching does not consider women taking care of the household activities as a violation of their rights and illiteracy but you consider it as such, its better you hold your opinion and i hold mine. And it is high time for you guys to leave islam alone.

Lionger

Hmm. I searched the internet for your quotes and the only places I found them intact was on Islamic websites, all of which credited them to 'Western scholars'. I'm very curious to know who these scholars are cuz I find it hard to believe that such statements can be made in public without the very predictable and very loud media backlash
[/code]

I did not quote from any Islamic website, the truth is that don't visit any Islamic website cose one can hardly differenciate between the genuine ones and those trying to subvert the religion. But do you know that there are attitudinal problems amongst children across the western world???



Husnaa,

How many men adequately keep their wives provided with all the necessities they require? How many men bother to do so at all? You said earlier that women work under the excuse that they contribute to the household economy. Well its not an excuse it is the result of the incapacity of the men to step up to their God Given responsibilities of being the economic providers of the home.

As in every society, there are responsible and irresponsible men but you cant tell me majority of men dont discharge their duties adequately. What complicate everything is that you women of now adays impose so many things that are unnecessary as your priorities, for example, Majority of women can quarrel with their husbands for not giving them money for Ashobe, i hope you are not among :lol:.  The major economic responsibilities are food, shelter, clothing, anything outside these, will be at the discretion of the husband.

And then u said that once the money starts to flow, women demand refund for every kobo spent. For how many average Nigerian families does the money start to flow? The majority of Nigerian families will spend their productive years earning less than 50,000 per month. So how does that equate with enough - to - surplus money flowing into the family coffers for the wife to demand a refund? If you know cases of women who demand refunds for household expenses, it is because you live well above the poverty line. But since there are many more below the poverty line than above it, then your observations are not the general manner of things in the society.

When i said start to flow, i dont mean flowing as in water gushing from a tap or a fountain, most women dont agree to share their money no matter how meagre it is. They always assert that their money is solely to themselves while the husband's own is for them to share. It is always my opinion that women dont have any business working since they wont contribute financially, the husband always looses on two fronts, since they will definately leave the household activities unattended and yet dont contribute the little they earn. In some other cases wifes who contribute financially use that as derogatory statements against their husbands at the slightest provacation or if he decides to go for a second wife. Is that not so??? :?:  :?:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

There are no religious injunctions that prohibit women from going out and earning a livelihood. The only injunctions are limits to the sort of work a woman can engage in.....

That will be perfect if you can effectively combine the two. Can you?

....and since you are not married (never been probably), you cant know anything about it from the inside, therefore you have NO grounds to talk about it to ppl with many years of experience  ... so there!!!

Oh yes i have never been married but am from a very extended family and one of the youngest, i know how my sisters are unfairly treating their husbands.  Don't tell me you are married :o  anyway, i hope you and other married women, if there are, have your husbands permission before contributing to this forum.

[lionger]

I did not quote from any Islamic website, the truth is that don't visit any Islamic website cose one can hardly differenciate between the genuine ones and those trying to subvert the religion. But do you know that there are attitudinal problems amongst children across the western world???

Doesn't matter if you quoted from a website or not Barde, I just wish a name was put to those quotes. I'd like to know who these scholars are, esp. cuz i disagree with them! Lets look at those quotes again..

In human history the periods which have been plagued with decay and degeration are those in which women have stepped outside their homes

I have firm belief that this world will transform into heaven if women shoud be content in cherishing their children and fulfulling their domestic responbilities.

I have serious issues with both statements. Outside of any hard facts and research, they are rather bombastic. Societal 'decay and degredation' is obviously a function of many things, not just the 'emancipation' of women. Therefore it will take much more than women living up to their domestic responsibilities to 'transform this world into heaven'. Statements such as the above do not really make sense under scrutiny.

Attitudinal problems among children in the West? Well there are such issues of course, but is it solely due to the absence of women in the home? I don't think so.

[_Waziri_]

lionger,

I suppose, Barde was paraphrasing Prof Cyril Joad who said: " The world will be a better place if women were content to go back into their homes even if some lowering of standard of living is involved therein."

You can search for his name online, you will see the title of his books from which I'll give you the title to read and extract the quote. You'll also need to know who he is by checking for his profile online.

Also apart from him are scholors like Dr. Fulton Sheen who wrote Communism and the Conscience of the West. He too expressed similar  sentiments. Again there is also the thing about the 93 percent of women who want.....read for yourself here:


And so only now-given the choice-women in the West are choosing to stay home to raise their children. According to the United States Department of Agriculture, only 31 percent of mothers with babies, and 18 percent of mothers with two or more children, are working full-time. And of those working mothers, a survey conducted by Parenting Magazine in 2000, found that 93% of them say they would rather be home with their kids, but are compelled to work due to 'financial obligations'. These 'obligations' are imposed on women by the gender sameness of the modern West, and removed from women by the gender distinctiveness of Islam.

The above is from an article by a friend with the following identification:

Yasmin Mogahed received a B.S. in psychology from the University of Wisconsin-Madison. She is currently a graduate student in Journalism/Mass Communications at the University of Wisconsin-Madison and working as a free lance writer.

Well, all of the above was to prove the truth of what Barde was saying as you requested, not to give my own opinion about the issue. But I'll do just that if anybody wants to hear. :wink:  :wink:  :wink:  :lol:  :lol:

[dan mama]

pls i will like to hear ur opinion waziri perharps i will learn one or two things. cheers

[bakangizo]

It is really unfortunate that our muslim women have been gripped by the fever of 'emancipation', as doctored by the West. What does that mean? I find it disturbing that our women failed to see that the whole idea of Women Liberalism/Emancipation was aimed at removing the toga of respectability Islam draped over the womenfolk. Being emancipated connotes the idea of someone shackled or prisoned. :roll:  I don't want to believe that's the situation our women are in. Must a woman be earning a living, or be financially/economically independent before she's respected? Is a working housewife a guarantee for a blissful and comfortable home/marriage? Family degeneration and marital collapse continue to rise in the West astronomically, despite their women working and 'liberalised'. Is that what we want? Allah (SWT) in His infinite mercy and wisdom has sent down a " division of labour" for the home; the wife to take care of the home front, children upbringing inclusive; while the man is charged with the responsibility of providing for the needs of the entire family. Are we questioning the wisdom of the above injuction by Allah (SWT)? Now how can a woman effectively discharge her duties from the working place? It is no surprise then that this days children lack proper upbringing, growing up un-cared for in a scattered home. Aren't we being a little hyprocritical here? If the man shirked his responsibility of providing adequately, to the best of his ability, then surely that does not in any way has to do with Islam, but the fallability of man, and he would answer for it. :!:  

What's even annoying is the way women hide under the guise of wanting to help the husband provide for the family, as the reason they must work! It's a farce, as I don't believe most of our women, or women generally, are that altruistic. Islam allowed women to work, agreed. But what type of work? How? And for what purpose? So 'yan uwana mata ku yi hattara. A bi a hankali dai, ka da rudin yahudu da nasara su ja mu zuwa halaka.

[lionger]

lionger,

I suppose, Barde was paraphrasing Prof Cyril Joad who said: " The world will be a better place if women were content to go back into their homes even if some lowering of standard of living is involved therein."

Not so sure about that Waziri. For one thing, you do realise the huge difference b/w saying 'the world will be a better place if women...' and 'i have firm belief this world will transform into heaven if...' What's more, the Islamic websites I talked of earlier used Barde's exact words! Did they somehow manage to paraphrase Cyril Joad with the same words by mere coincidence? Doubtful indeed.

[_Waziri_]

Ok,
Lionger you can provide mer with the links of those Islamic   websites you scrolled thru that I maybe able to verify the truth of my claim or otherwise.

dan mama,

I will give you my reasons on due course, right now my boss is on my neck with an uncompleted job for me to process.

[lionger]

Here you go Waziri:

http://www.allaahuakbar.net/womens/equality_and_status_of_women_in_islaam.htm

http://www.msapubli.com/affiliated/Html/categories/Jamiatul_ulama/ewomen.html

http://www.jamiat.org.za/isinfo/ewomen.html

http://www.knowingislam.8m.com/statuswomen.html

On closer inspection though all these websites have published the same article, so there is one source.

[_Waziri_]

Ok lionger,

Hav seen the article several years back and I am convinced of my position that the author was wrong in mis quoting Prof. Cyril Joad. Thanx once again.

[amira]

Hey!!!
you guys come back lets continue with this intresting thread.

[amira]

Thank u Amira, Fateez for yr support.  :D With yr votes, we will have a landslide victory. Fateez VP, Amira, take over from ken Nnamani. Meanwhile Lionger, u become special advisor and minister for Men's affairs, and Zizo, Now how would u like a portfolio as ambassador at large and plenipotentiary? 8)

Barde,  :evil: I have reserved a cell for u at Abu Ghraib and U Muhsin choose between kirikiri and Guantanomo Bay. :twisted:

Bakan Gizo explain yrself first and maybe u can save yrself from the  treasonable assertion na kishiya.  :x We wont entertain any opposition parties here. We intend to fully implement the tazarce syndrome in this govt. For that reason, I am blacklisting Guest33 who is  already nominating someone else....  Expect a friendly visit from the secret service soon...... :evil:

Cool so when do we proceed??? ;D