Author Topic: Kwara advance  (Read 8530 times)

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Offline Indabawa

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« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2004, 09:52:53 AM »
Quote from: "Dave_McEwan_Hill"
That is very good news about Kano State and I am glad to hear it.
The farmers coming to Kwara however do not have large amounts of capital and they are not coming to own land. They are being hired to use their expertise to the benefit of Kwara State. As I said before Kwara State is fully in charge of the programme not the incoming farmers.



Sorry Mr Dave,it seems you missed the point of my argument.What we are essentialy implying is that:must we bring in foreign farmers while we have a teeming jobless graduates whom may be easily encouraged to venture in to farming?Likewise,with conscious effort our various Governments should be able to rejuvinate the sector,like what Kano state is presently doing.

For the technical expertise,i think we need only to encourage our various research institutions,by adequate funding,to make them cope with our farming needs.But where the required expertise is lacking,i think we should negotiate to source the relevant technology on a mutual bilateral arrangement.

It is my utmost belief that Nigeria and indeed Nigerian stake holders are equal to the task.Mr Dave,did you know that almost all of the seed varieties that are being cultivated in Nigeria are a product of our tireless scientists,in some cases, with active collaboration of their foreign partners.

Therefore,once again,the solution in my view is for the Government functionaries to discard the toga of that any thing-foriegn-is-superior,and look inwards by articulating a far reaching and practical approach to our basic needs-the need to be food sufficcient in the near future.

These could be achieved by aggressively tackling the root causes of our failure to be assertive in the food security of our people.

These measures could involve the review of our land tenure system,adequate funding of our research institutions,manding commercial banks to invest in the sector,establishing functional agro-allied industries etc

By these measures,i should believe it will just be a matter of time for Nigeria to among the clib of food exporters.
e who kneels to Allah can stand up to anything.

Offline al_hamza

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« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2004, 11:01:26 AM »
I perosnally believe it the biggest curse when a people raise their hands and say "we cant do this" i believe our people have a brain two hands two legs, kidneys, lungs ....... everything just like the "white men". what we lack is DISCIPLINE.  i have visited RANO several times which is just on the outskirts of kano on the way to zaria, if you believe we arent capable of doing anything, visit the place and see for youself how energetic and fruitfull our farmers are.

Wallahi in gaya muku gaskiya, its only because of fata, i have seen for myself on many occasions in Nigeria and many other places that a foriegner (always a fairer complexion) is heard but a local is shun (except if he has "nera"). If we start listening to our own people/farmers, understand their demands and supply them with what they need..... we will not have our Naira/Dollars going abroad (which is a serious setback to an economy).

If the invitation of the ex-zimbabwean TYRANT LAND LORDS is a catalyst for our own farmers, then we should welcome them with open arms, but if they are bieng invited because we feel we "cant do anything" then we ought to frown at our policy makers, because that "we" is me and you!

I CAN DO IT, SO CAN YOU! WHAT WE NEED IS TO GET OUR GOVERNMENTS ATTENTION.
ABILUNAH? SABILUNAH? AL-JIHAD! AL-JIHAD!

Offline Eskimo

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« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2004, 12:45:19 PM »
Quote from: "waz"
Quote from: "Eskimo"
Haba malam waziri .


Seems like we've got a case of mistaken identity, well for the record i'm not a mallam and not the waziri you might think.


I know..but I just assume you name too is waziri, hence waz.
color=blue]NOBODY is PERFECT and I am NOBODY.[/color]

Offline _Waziri_

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« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2004, 10:46:18 AM »
I am really impressed with the content and the context of the debate going on around here.  I will then cease not to congratulate Mr. David, EMTL and the rest including My namesake WAZ who made some interesting inputs.

It appears like there is nothing to add. Only to draw the attention of  Mr. David that even though we should not care as to who owns what company in our country. We must also realise that UK government in its policy will never allow foregners take control of the thing that is the mainstay of its economy. That for sure.

I remain most grateful.

Offline Dave_McEwan_Hill

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« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2004, 11:45:10 PM »
In reply to Waziri I have to point out that the majority of industry and manufacturing in UK is owned by foreign companies - mostly Japanese, Taiwanese, American, German and multi-national firms.
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Offline al_hamza

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« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2004, 11:48:38 AM »
Mr David, even though you are much senior to me, (maybe you could be my GrandPa's age) but it seems its me that has to teach you here, maybe you have only read the word "ECONOMICS" but never what its all about. I wont give a lenghty lecture, as most of my brothers here am sure have some knowledge of economics.

England has become one of the most expensive labour markets. whats the minimum hourly wage in the UK? 3.5pounds right? Your country has reached a point where small industries cannot or find it hard to survive, As you might know industries are the major employers in a developed nation (especially like yours where very little natural resources exist). So to achieve profits and to survive, companies have to opperate on a massive scale. let me cut the biblical verse of economics short "UK must go MULTI NATIONAL TO SURVIVE".

So please stop bragging about saying foriegn investment is welcomed in the UK,

GRANDPA! (AXTAGHFURULLAH MY GRANDPA WASNT A KAFIR) YOU NEED IT TO HAVE YOUR ECONOMY GOING!
ABILUNAH? SABILUNAH? AL-JIHAD! AL-JIHAD!

Offline _Waziri_

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« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2004, 11:08:43 AM »
Yes Sir,

But yet one will wonder as to what are the Ukites doing all along that they could not provide and man their industries? Are they only consumers? some people without brains to climb the  height of industrialisation? For those among us who know or hear about Ukites, they will find it difficult to believe the region is in the hands of foreigners economically.

Though I know that the Jews have been in control of everything money in the region since over a century back - by the records of Mr. Balfeur's dealings with them, as documented by ppl like Edmund Burke and other writings of  Wiston Churchilll - but yet we will find it difficult to understand how the Taiwans and others could over shadow these Jews and the natives of the  region.

Offline alhaji_aminu

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« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2004, 02:46:39 AM »
salam

al_hamza i believe you got something fundamentally wrong about your economics lecture. Industialized countries now have a larger service economy and the trend is growing. This means, manufacturing jobs are shrinking and jobs like telemarketing and consulting are mushrooming.

I am not arguing with your point in globalization with it's attendent negative consequences.

peace.....

Offline mallamt

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« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2004, 02:49:08 PM »
Myadudu
Quote from: "myadudu"
hi
mallamt you know I like you for one thing- your irrational thought process when someone discusses anything not to your liking. I am sure that isnt a virtue, but if it really is then more power to you.

What are you saying here? would you rather I agree with you because disagreeing with you or anyone is irrational? This is some very strange position and smacks of utter arrogance coming from you!!!  You may want to point at what is irrational in my position or else stop making useless and arrogant statements!!
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"I really wonder how many of these farmers myadudu knows personally to the point he knows that they are anti independence group"
And I answer, is there a 'threshold-knowledge' requirement before one can write about the issue in question?

You may say there is.  As they say there are alwys two sides to a story and if we want to be fair we must try and make our points as objective as possible.  May I ask you have you heard or know the term stereotyping?  Are Nigerians criminals?  Are muslims violent and blood seeking people? Think carefully about yor answers.  Is it possible that people who hold veiw such as Nigerians are criminals or muslims are violent are not being objective and fair?  Is it possible that they have closed their eyes and ears to the other side of the story?  Please also note that in saying that Nigerians are not criminals one is not saying that there are no criminally minded nigerians etc
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And secondly, you seem to be saying that since the white farmers are seeking their livelihood in an independent country then there position as overlords is rather trivial? No can say, mallamt.

I do not know where you got that idea from I believe this is just another case of you shooting your mouth off while trying to meander round the issue and refusing to tackle the matter at hand.  Remember what started the whole discussion was the issue of possible benefits to nigeria and in particular kwara state of white zimbabwe farmers.  Do you think there are any or not lets discuss that except if you believe seating in your previlaged position that nigerians should not have access to a better life therefore we should not allow people who can show us a better way to do things we have failed to do in decades to come into our country.  Please see the portion i commented on mobile telephony in nigeria, that was technology that was delebrately kept away from nigerians for years only the elitist few had access, so i would not be surprised that you are one of those nigerians that are unhappy because mobile telephones are now lossing their position every year as status symbols in our society.
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It is a fact that whites own 70% of the fertile land in that country. A country which they weren't invited to but they, nonetheless, 'illegally' and 'criminally' colonised.
You can have your opinions on whether serfdom (suffered by the black peasants) is not caused by white farmers; But this much is clear: the white farmers in Zimbabwe weren't interested in Rhodesia becoming independent. And most of those white farmers now are the one holding the lands in Zimbabwe
auguspeilt!
I can assure you that whites owning so much land is not as much a problem than how they got it!!  If they got it through legitimate process it would not be an issue and that is why most african governments understand Mugabes position, however the problem with Mugabes approach to addressing the issue is the problem and not his wanting to address the matter.  Again I see you have gone back to your stereotyping of people for what ever reason you do that well I do not know.

Offline alhaji_aminu

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« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2004, 01:18:08 AM »
salam
mallamt welcome back.

Your attempt to understand what I meant by 'disagreeing with me' misses the point completely. I said and I am saying now that if [you] disagree with me on an issue on which [you] are obviously and incontrovetibly wrong then indeed [you] are in a state of denial*.

* Note I used irrational at the last point. See postcript for why I am changing the word for a clause now.

Secondly, I am not been stereotypical at all on this issue. As regards to white farmers in Zimbabwe this much is a fact- and facts are sacred. They own 70% of the productive land and most of it wasn't procured under legally justifiable circumstances.  And I ask you this question, did you disagree with the fact that white Zimbabweans acquired most of thier holdings illegally?

Thirdly you said, "I can assure you that whites owning so much land is not as much a problem than how they got it!! " I cannot disagree more and this is why. White people in Zimbabwe whether we like it or not are not native there ( note alot left Zimbabawe for London after dispossed of their land instead of moving to other parts of the country). And their owning more land (productive) than 'original natives' can constitute an enormous national and economic security threat. For example, if there is to be a War (god forbid) between UK and Zimb, and the Zimb govt decides to 'intern' Whites (for obvious reasons), then the lossed production arising from not cultivating the white own land can bankrupt and starve the nation. So ,any nation that is concerned about it's security ( meaning it has a constitution)  will never allow one group or one set or one tribe or one clan or one region   of people to gain control of a  dispropotionate amount of any resource  legally or illegally.
 
lastly, I must say you made an excellent point on the Darfur situation (look at my response) .

As always, your response is welcome. Allah ya bamu alherinsa.

PS: The use of the word (irrational) is highly regretted. I assure you I wrote that post in a hurry and hadn't the convinience of cross checking my post. Other than that, I stick to my assertions and use of words

Offline mallamt

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« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2004, 10:33:02 PM »
myadudu

my dear frind you are really digressing from the issue at hand!  You have not said anything yet but have rambled all sorts of things!!!
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Your attempt to understand what I meant by 'disagreeing with me' misses the point completely. I said and I am saying now that if [you] disagree with me on an issue on which [you] are obviously and incontrovetibly wrong then indeed [you] are in a state of denial*.

You have not said exactly what is "wrong" with what I have said in context of the discussion of white zimbabwe farmers assisting us with agriculture.
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Secondly, I am not been stereotypical at all on this issue. As regards to white farmers in Zimbabwe this much is a fact- and facts are sacred. They own 70% of the productive land and most of it wasn't procured under legally justifiable circumstances. And I ask you this question, did you disagree with the fact that white Zimbabweans acquired most of thier holdings illegally?

Indeed white farmers own about 70% of productive land in Zimbabwe and this is land that has been passed down fom one generation to the next.  If you had bothered to read my previous posting I said clearly the problem lies in how this land was acquired!!! In other words there is a problem with legality!!! So you question was answered in my posting which you were responding to.  You see you obviously did not read my posting!! so this point is null and void!!!
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Thirdly you said, "I can assure you that whites owning so much land is not as much a problem than how they got it!! " I cannot disagree more and this is why. White people in Zimbabwe whether we like it or not are not native there ( note alot left Zimbabawe for London after dispossed of their land instead of moving to other parts of the country). And their owning more land (productive) than 'original natives' can constitute an enormous national and economic security threat. For example, if there is to be a War (god forbid) between UK and Zimb, and the Zimb govt decides to 'intern' Whites (for obvious reasons), then the lossed production arising from not cultivating the white own land can bankrupt and starve the nation. So ,any nation that is concerned about it's security ( meaning it has a constitution) will never allow one group or one set or one tribe or one clan or one region of people to gain control of a dispropotionate amount of any resource legally or illegally.

Its good to see you started with qouting my posting and as you can see it answers your previous point and also this point to some extent.  I find your third point just ramblings viod of any direction.  However a simple question to you are hausa/fulani native of kaduna? or hausas, ibos and yorubas native of abuja?  we can go on and on.  The major issue on the land question has always been how land is acquired rather than who owns it or is resident on it land acquired through legitimate means without deceit has never posed too much of a problem!
 The fact of the matter is that for whatever reason we have failed woefully in agriculture and any nation serious about development and growth must be able to feed its populace.  Kano state alone or Kaduna state probably have more government sponsored agricultural programs (subsidised ferterliser, dams (fadamas) etc) than the whole of zimbabwe yet zimbabwe (even with less rainfall) produces twice more food than nigeria, does that not tell you something?  What about all the agricultural reasearch institutes in the country? how has our food production been enhanced to cater for modern day nigeria demands?  There is obviously something fundamentally wrong with the way agriculture is practised in nigeria and these white zimbabweans should be able to show us a different way to get things done.  We still carryout agriculture like in the pre independence era if not even worse, we have created all these fancy institutions like KNARDA, KASCO, FASCOM etc to swell the number of "big men" we definately have a warped sense of agriculture and it is challenges like these (the zimbabweans) that we need hopefully we remove these "big men" managers and get down to the reall nitty gritty of farming!!!  There is no need for us to romanticise with these institutions or even claim that we can do it now when we could not do it for over forty years!! it is all a farse we should be honest with ourself own up and ask for outside help!!

 


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