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HABA JANAR - LET IT GO MANA

Started by Dan-Borno, September 12, 2007, 09:52:27 AM

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Dan-Borno

Former President Olusegun Obasanjo yesterday floored the presidential candidate of the All Nigeria Peoples Party (ANPP), Major General Muhammad Buhari (rtd) as the Election Petition Tribunal in Abuja said that joining the former president in the petition or insisting that he must appear to respond to allegations has  no basis in law. In a similar vein, General Buhari reacted to the withdrawal of his party?s petition, saying that it was an attempt to make the country a one-party state.
General Buhari had asked the tribunal to nullify the last general election, which he alleged was rigged. He further averred that Chief Obasanjo played a major role in the alleged malpractices. But delivering the ruling yesterday, the tribunal Chairman, Justice James Ogede said that making Obasanjo a party to the suit contravened section 142 (2) of the Electoral Act 2006 adding that since Obasanjo was not a candidate in the controversial election, there was no reason to join him.
He expressed no hesitation in striking out the name of the former president from the list of respondents, stressing that the tribunal did not bother itself on the issue of immunity clause raised by the counsel.
Justice Ogede whose ruling was agreed to by other four justices on the panel said that the provision of the law relating to the joinder was unambiguous and it states that only electoral officers could be joined in the petition in their official capacities. Obasanjo, he said, was not a candidate in the election and therefore not a compulsory party whose absence as a respondent could not affect the outcome of the petition. He said the allegation contained in the petition that Obasanjo misused the armed forces to rig the election could be handled independent of the petition.

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I dont know why this man is dragging this thing
too much, its time he stops fighting democracy
and concentrate on other issues.  So far so good,
this Yar'adua Government has been very fair, and
within his 100 days in office, so many changes
have happened.

Janar, enjoy your retirement, come 2011 ANPP
has their choice of candidate for the Presidency.
We appreciate your concern for the survival of
our nascent democracy, we will always remember
you as a hero in uniform and agbada.

"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

HUSNAA

Haba Dan Borno, leave the janar alone. He is fighting democracy? ko dai he is fighting FOR democracy? An nakasa democracy an yi kwace sai kuma a ce ba za a samu wa'yanda za suyi adawa da haka ba?  Haka za mu ci gaba a rika yi mana danniya ana sace mana rights din mu kuma a ce wai sai mu hakura? Leave the jannar alone!
Allah dai ya baiwa janar din mutanen da za su tsaya abayan sa ba don abin da suke hange za su samu ba bayan ya hau kan mulki.
JANAR DONT EVER LET IT GO! U ARE OUR LAST BASTION OF HOPE IN THIS CRIPPLED DEMOCRACY CALLED NIGERIA!! >:(
Ghafurallahi lana wa lakum

bakangizo

Well, I'm with you Husnaa, I believe he should fight on. Any govt formed on the basis of treachery and injstice should be fought. I refused to be swayed by the misguided notion of yaradua will do well. In as much as he allowed the atrocities of the last election to be commited on his behalf, for his selfish desire to be president, he's as bad as OBJ. I don't know if ANPP had withdrawn their petition. If they did, it is a slap on our face, and Allah ya isa.

HUSNAA

Quote from: Bakan~Gizo on September 16, 2007, 01:03:02 PM

I don't know if ANPP had withdrawn their petition. If they did, it is a slap on our face, and Allah ya isa.

Wallahi they have withdrawn it.
Ghafurallahi lana wa lakum

sheriff 05

Unfortunately Allanguro, I completely disagree with you on this point. Why should the general withdraw his petition? Like you and I, shouldnt he have a right to seek legal redress when he is wronged? In my opinion, there is nothing wrong at all if he continues to push on should he choose to. So long as he feels he has the means and the reason to do so, he's free to do so. The question you should have raised is being in his position would you choose to carry on or withdraw, considering the other subtle issues of PR, public image, elderly respect and deft politicking in our society. Your position or comment should be an advisory position Dan Borno, in which case I clearly understand your view point, vis-a-vis maintaining his respectful status in society.

Personally I feel he should push on, without compromise but with more wisdom and with an open eye to understanding the political game and how it works. He needs to understand the game of politics a lot more. He needs to see that the only difference between PDP, ANPP and any other political party for that matter is simply, OPPORTUNITY. Therefore while we acknowledge and support him for his attributes and his vision for Nigeria, it would take a little more than that to navigate the corridors of power and secure his seat, thus defeating the "politicians" in their own rotten game.

But my support for his petition is part of a much larger issue. A major point of correction Dan Borno, in my opinion, even if he should withdraw his petition IT SHOULD NOT BE ON THE BASIS OF WHETHER OR NOT THIS GOVERNMENT IS DOING WELL.. becasue regardless of how well Yar'adua does IT DOES NOT AND WILL NEVER GIVE HIM LEGITIMACY in the eyes of we who seek truth, fairness and justice. Being a man of "pragmatic peace", I would still say Allah ya bashi zaman lafiya, but make no mistake, the government as effective as it may be is still and will be (at least for the next four years) undoubtedly illegitimate.

This is not because I am naive to politics but merely because a distincition has to be drawn at some point. we dont condone wrong because it was done by one of us. If my brother is wrong, He remains wrong and if he has wronged my enemy, he still remains wrong. that is what I was taught. The end does not justify the means, that is not the way, that is not the Islamic way. We cant build a sound society if we accept wrong where it is clearly wrong. We just cant.  Where is the fairness in that? Is not a better society what we seek?

Thats why I support Buhari's petition, simply because he reminds us of what this country ought to be. I know that he is highly unlikely to be successful even at our "fair" electoral tribunals. But by pushing it through the legal channel and challenging this, he stands for a lot more than merely defending his mandate. He stands to represent we who believe that in all situations, the right thing should be done always.

Is that too much to ask?

HUSNAA

Clap clap clap.. the making of a statesman speaking... very sound arguments and very well put.
Ghafurallahi lana wa lakum

Dan-Borno

Allah ya saka da alheri malam Sheriff.
Even though we have been busy saying our mind
or rather opinion, a lot of things must be put into
consideration, especially after the election is over.

Before and during the election, all and sundry knew
quite alright that the then government of Ubanshegu
is bent by any means to hand over this government
to Yar'adua and there is no point fighting for it.
I can remember, i started a thread on the 2007 election
Election or War - because the way Ubanshegu took
the issue of Presidential seat is far beyond personal.
Political soothsayers have predicted either civil war
or Yar'adua and Buhari has been adequately informed.

If that is the case, and considering the clamour from
the north that power must shift, what is the waste of
time for?

Another issue i want us to consider also is; despite
this election was held in a fraudulent manner, i doubt
much if the Janar is going to get away with the required
percentage to earn him the number 1 seat.

Times without number, Yar'adua has publicly stated that
we are still in the learning process of democracy, so
instead of us wasting much time in trying to define
and interprete our laws, why dont we calm down and
prepare adequately for the upcoming 2011 election?

My last argument which has always been my argument
is that, in politics, party machinery is much more
important than candidacy.  No matter how popular you
might be, if the machineries of the party are not at
your disposal, you are bound to fail.  So did Janar,
he was only a candidate with no party machinery at
his disposal.  The party's decision is final.
"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

HUSNAA

DB, I cant disagree  with you more.  Your arguments are full of perforations. If they were a bucket, they will not hold water at all.
If gwamnatin OBJ is bent on handing the govt to 'yaradua, in a fraudlent way, that still doesnt mean that ppl should acquiesce to that. Why should there be no point in fighting it? Isnt that what democracy is all about? Politcal soothsayers have predicted either war or 'yar adua... That is the most preposterous thing I have heard in a long time. Who are these political pundits? OBJ cannot be that senile. I know I heard him say that this was  a do or die affair, but one cant literally translate it to mean civil war if they lose.

If as you write that the Janar would not be able to get away with the required percentage that wouldnt be such a problem in the long run because if he lost in a full and fair election, he would surely concede to the winner. So why cant we be allowed to hold a fair election and if he has to lose then fine, the point is that this RIGHT was denied not only to the General and Atiku, but also to the bulk of us Nigerian masses, who were not allowed to manifest our wishes. And since you are saying that what is the waste of time for? you forget that ppl's time and energy were wasted, by making them go to a cooked up, half baked parody of an election. OBJ should just have declared 'yar adua as the president without wasting our time, and govt money in rigging up an already decided election.

That we are still in the learning process of democracy... come on!!  'Yar adua and whoever are saying this, are just insulting the ppl's intellingence! How long does it take for a kid to enrol and finish  primary sch, how long secondary and  how long for university? Each of these stages is a learning process which is CONCLUDED at the end of it and for which one is deemed capable of going forward to the next stage. This means that the scholar has learned his lessons at each stage for him to be able to move forward and each of these stages takes less than the eight yrs that OBJ has been in power!  Suppose someone were to take the sum total of the yrs on spends at sch as the period of the learning process, i.e. from primary sch  to university, that would be 5yrs plus 6 yrs plus 4 yrs. A total of 15 yrs. If we take Nigeria's staggered democratic system, we have had as much time as that, starting from the year of independence. So what learning process are we talking about?  Nothing but greed for wealth and power  propels our political machinery and as long as they remain the yardstick for  yearning for office, nothing will ever change. This has nothing to do with any learning process. Its just the phrases used to hoodwink the stupefied masses.

We mustnt interprete our laws? because if we did, it maybe that the powers that be will be found to be on the wrong side of the law right? so just let sleeping dogs lie. That is what you are advocating? Where is the democracy in this?

You know something? to the devil with the party machinery. You have surely heard of independent candidates who have no parties to back them. Buhari having had the ppl's support solidly behind him, would not have needed munafikan ANPP su tsaya masa. They were just using him at any rate to begin with, because of his popularity with the masses. I wish he'd realized that much earlier.
Buhari doesnt need a party machinery behind him because if he leaves ANPP today, the bulk of the talakawa will vacate ANPP as well, myself included. Ni infact ma bana ANPP anymore, I thoroughly dislike the party. Nothing but a bunch of selfish self serving opportunists.

  Zakaran da Allah Ya nufa da chara ko ana muzuru ko ana shaho sai yayi, party or no party.  If the masses hadnt been intimidated not to come out and demonstrate in another orange revolution style kind of picketting, at least 'yar adua may probably not be the president today. Maybe not even Buhari, but at least it wouldnt be an unelected leader!
Ghafurallahi lana wa lakum

mlbash


munki! munki! munki! we gonna fight it to the last!
:-X
t is my intention to make the neglected aspect of our societies viable

Dan-Borno

#9
What about Sheik's comment Malam Bash?

Islamically, Buhari Must Withdraw His Election Case - Gumi

Weekly Trust (Kaduna)

INTERVIEW
15 September 2007
Isa Sa'idu
Kaduna

Prominent Kaduna-based Islamic cleric, Dr. Ahmed Abubakar Gumi, in this interview, says going by Islamic strictures, General Buhari has no option but to drop his election petition against President Umaru Yar'Adua.

Weekly Trust: What informed your call on aggrieved politicians to withdraw their cases from the electoral tribunals given the widespread condemnation of the elections?


Gumi: To answer that question, I have to start by clarifying my position on the April elections. I want to say I am not ignorant of the fact that the elections were flawed in many areas and aspects.
This is not the first time I am saying this. I said a similar thing even before the elections through a press release which I issued in November 2006, five months before the elections. I made the press release to notify the public that from the conduct of the voters' registration, I have seen many flaws in which I concluded that the elections may not be free and fair. I came to the country (from Saudi Arabia) to observe the conduct of the elections myself. I have gone round and seen problems associated with the elections all along. I was not surprised with what I saw since the infrastructures for a credible elections are not on ground before the elections, therefore it would amount to self deceit for somebody to expect a house built on wrong foundation and such a house to last long or be strong.

Since all the parties have agreed with the weak foundation on which the elections lied on and consented that the INEC was capable of conducting an election, so it means they have consented to the weak foundation on which the election was built. They should therefore agree with the outcome of the election. Whoever and whichever party joined that election must agree with the outcome of that election. They know that the foundation was weak and yet went ahead to participate in the election. Many politicians and people like us have said the nation was not ready for the election but all those people that are crying now accepted and their parties that the elections will be credible. This is just like joining a car which has no good tires and its driver is drunk. What else do you expect more than an accident? We have to deal with whole issue in a moral way. They all agreed to join an election which has no solid foundation when they know that the election was not well planned to be credible.

WT: But the politicians, especially the prominent ones among them, have also made such observations before the elections.

Gumi: Then why do they join the elections? They have to bear the consequences. As Islamic scholars, we take the interest of the whole nation into consideration first. Parties are fighting for their interest. Individuals within the parties are fighting for theirs too. The interest of the nation is to have peace, unity and tranquility before we start talking about the ethics of democracy. Democracy, power shift or leadership are fiddlers to peace and stability. Therefore, we cannot compromise the peace and stability of the nation based on personal, party or group interest.I observed that most of the parties before the April elections were themselves not ready for the election, not only the INEC. Most of the parties did not send their polling agents to the polling units. Where the party agents are sent, their allowances were not paid. They don't have people to represent them in sensitive areas. In short, all the parties are deficient. How can we take somebody's negligence and compromise the unity and peace of this nation? This is why I advised the aggrieved candidates to withdraw their cases.

Already people were sworn in into offices what we should now do is to see that a credible electoral system is put in place so that the next election will be credible. Poverty alleviation, elimination of ignorance and diseases should also be our priority as a nation. We should put our energy and efforts to see that the country's problems are tackled so that we can develop. If we say we will fight the government or call for the cancellation of the elections, we can never have credible elections because the infrastructures are not there. The INEC has no money and credible personnel to conduct free and fair elections and most of the parties are weak. If another election is to be conducted, we will only end up in chaos.

WT: You have acknowledged that the elections were flawed. The politicians in the tribunals are agitating for justice. Are they not doing the right thing Islamically since Islam promotes justice?

Gumi: My decision to advice the aggrieved politicians to withdraw their court cases was based on two pillars. On the pure Islamic perspective, regardless of the way and manner in which somebody is sworn in to govern, that person must be obeyed. Islam has wisdom behind this. Islam looks at the interest of the nation and peace. Once a leader is given allegiance by some people, Islam demands that he should be obeyed. This is because if you attempt to remove him, his own supporters could cause break down of law and order or even sabotage the new administration. The Prophet (pbuh) was reported to have said, "One who dislikes a thing done by his leader should be patient over it. For anyone from the people who withdraws his obedience from the government, even to the extent of a hand-span and died in that condition, would die the death of one belonging to the days of ignorance (Jahiliyya)." Ideally as I said, the politicians should not have participated in the elections but they made a mistake to take part and a leader had emerged they should therefore bear the fruits of their mistakes. They agreed with rigging and the rigging has taken place.What I am saying is that let's forget the past and build a strong system that will not allow rigging of elections. Even the countries that we are copying democracy from, what they did was to build a system that will not allow rigging. Had it been their system allows rigging, they could have rigged their elections as we are doing here.

WT: Don't you think this position would aid election malpractices in the future?

Gumi: I gave you an Islamic perspective that if a cream of people in the society accepted and gave allegiance to a leader, he should be obeyed and I told you that the wisdom behind that is for peace and tranquility. All over the world politicians want to rig elections, what stops them from rigging is the infrastructure. The system gives them no room to rig. Let's make our system like that so that we can have the leaders who we want. But if we allow the system to continue like this rigging will continue. Even in America or England, if there is room for rigging their politicians will rig. No matter the preaching, we shouldn't deceive ourselves. Politicians always like to rig, what stops rigging is the system. This is why I said the solution to our problem is to build credible electoral infrastructures not nullifying faulty elections. Elections in this country had ever been faulty.


WT: Do you think the present administration is competent to build that credible electoral system given the way it came to power?

Gumi: I am very confident they can. If the warring parties join hands to develop the electoral reforms then they can together find solutions to our electoral problems. We need permanent polling units, permanent computerised voter register and in four years we can have that credible system. If that happens, the next elections from local governments to president will be free and fair.

WT: What happens if the aggrieved politicians refuse to withdraw their court cases?

Gumi: Islamically, once a cream of people has given allegiance to a leader it is forbidden to withdraw that allegiance. The Prophet said in a Hadith that, "You should listen to and obey your ruler even if he is a slave whose head looks like a raisin." In another Hadith he said, "The best of your rulers are those whom you love and who love you, who invoke Allah's blessings upon you and you invoke His blessings upon them. And the worst of your rulers are those whom you hate and who hate you and whom you curse and who curse you. It was asked by those present, shouldn't we overthrow them with the help of the sword? He said: no as long as they establish prayer among you. If you then find anything detestable in them you should hate their administration, but do not withdraw yourselves from their obedience." By this if the tribunals nullified the elections, especially the presidential, since Nigeria is not an Islamic state, what the Muslims will do if such happens, we will go and participate in the elections but nobody should elect these two people-Buhari and Atiku. Islamically, they are incompetent to rule because any Muslim who opposes the teachings of the prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is incapable of being a leader. Anybody who is not ready to make sacrifice to his people and nation such a person is not capable to be the leader. If these two giants are not ready to step down for peace and tranquility in this nation, then they are not capable to be leaders. If there would be another election we will tell Muslims to shun them with all our heart. Anybody who follows them will follow them on the risk of losing his faith in Allah.

WT: The Islamic allegiance you are talking about, does it apply to a state like Nigeria which is said to be secular in nature?

Gumi: Somebody will say we are not an Islamic state, therefore, we shouldn't bring Islamic perspective to it. But the answer to this is Islam is based on those things that take care of the people's welfare. Islamic principles are based on facts that are natural irrespective of who is involved or his country. This is to help the society. The people we are talking about are Muslims therefore, Islamic principles are applicable to them. What we are saying is that the money that will be used in conducting another election can be used, with the cooperation of Buhari and Atiku, to build a credible electoral system that will not allow rigging in future elections. I am calling on the government to put time, money and credible people in the electoral reform. Let's work hand in hand to see that things are moving in the right directions. We cannot have development in commotion and chaos. I am appealing to the aggrieved politicians to step down their arms and work towards building a credible electoral system where we can elect the leaders of our choice. I want to call on the general public to please cooperate with the government and let's start building a country that we can be proud of. Let's build a country that will be free of corrupt leaders. We can achieve that through a strong and reliable electoral system that will enable us elect God fearing leaders.

"My mama always used to tell me: 'If you can't find somethin' to live for, you best find somethin' to die for" - Tupak

Mufi

I believe all these petitions and what have you are good for our growing and developing democracy in Nigeria, because if we don't voice our opposition and our voices, we will never have a True and Honest Democracy in the country. Everybody knew what the outcome of the election was going to be, but ppl still went out and voice their opinion through casting their votes.
Life is like a flower; more exquisite and precious when shared with others.

mlbash


sorry for that piece Dan Borno, i wasn't harsh. but the point is very clear, and i'm not disputing what malam said, let Buhari fight his (masses right ) to the last eve though, as i believe (deep in my heart) his not winning, but that's just the legal and democratic way. After that i don't want Buhari to say a single word ever! He was drag into politics by an organised conscipiracy Nigeria ever recorded in it's history, that's his fate and he just gonna live with that for the rest of his life. :'(
t is my intention to make the neglected aspect of our societies viable

waduz

How on earth can someone continue fighting a battle he konws he will not win? Buhari is a fine gentleman, an upright and courageous soldier, but to me, he is not a complete democrat and should better remain an elder statesman guiding and counselling our current crop of leaders. His rigidity has always denied him the loyalty of his party chiefs and ultimately the Nigerian Presidency.
In our democracy, at least during "mai hanci kaman gajeren wando"s time, anything goes! It was the WILL of the Almighty that Yaradua becomes the President, and is so far making strides. Let us pray for him to have good health and last the four years mandate.....simple! ;D

Muhsin

For days, I haven't been following the happenings in the news. I don't know things haven gone to that peak--though I heard of the news that ANPP had withdrawn is petition at court. But what attract my attention is what DB quoted Gumi saying in the Daily Trust. That statement absolutely surprise me though I haven't gone through every line of the piece because am afraid of the time but still I grasp where it headed.

Personally, before the election commenced, I can boldly say I wasn't at Bukharo's side and neither am I now. But how these so-called northern elites, pro-govt mallams (like Gumi), his party ANPP and the rest are bluffing him, trying to convince or persuade him grudgingly to withdraw his petition at court.

Kai, do you know one surprising point? At first Bukhari announced that he won't take anything to court but his party said it would and convinced him also to do, but when Yar-Adua called for a unity govt and they answered him due to apparently worldly possession shamelessly came back saying bula-bula. What a paradox? What an unjust? What a shame? Gosh!!!!!!!!
Get to know [and remember] Allah in prosperity & He will know  [and remember] you in adversity.

bakangizo

Quote from: waduz on September 28, 2007, 10:42:21 AM
How on earth can someone continue fighting a battle he konws he will not win? Buhari is a fine gentleman, an upright and courageous soldier, but to me, he is not a complete democrat and should better remain an elder statesman guiding and counselling our current crop of leaders. His rigidity has always denied him the loyalty of his party chiefs and ultimately the Nigerian Presidency.In our democracy, at least during "mai hanci kaman gajeren wando"s time, anything goes! It was the WILL of the Almighty that Yaradua becomes the President, and is so far making strides. Let us pray for him to have good health and last the four years mandate.....simple! ;D
I agree with that. I don't think Buhari is made for nigerian politics. And Hajiya Husnaa, he needs  a party machinery to succeed. And I'm not sure where he's headed to next. Cos going by his antecedents, whatever marriage he eventually contrive with whatever party (not only ANPP) is bound to collapse sooner or later. That said, I believe he should continue to fight this illegal govt. that was borne fraudulently. If we continue to live under the illusion of "our democracy is still a baby", when is it going to grow? I tell you that assertion was just coined by a selfish, wicked, greedy and morally corrupt politicians in order to continue to do as they wish. So the general should fight on. Its his right; its our right. It's mighty myiopic for someone to say ai tun da mulki ya dawo arewa shikenan. Are we saying it is okay to commit a crime in the name of arewa? How does it even going to benefit the average northerner? I don't give a hoot wherther 'Yaradua will do well, can do well or means well. I always say the mere fact that he collude with OBJ to perpetrate that atrocity (ppl killed, maimed, properties burned) in the name of election means he's as selfish and greedy as OBJ.