Scottish Islamic State Plotted

[Dave_McEwan_Hill]

Robert Mugabe who has turned from a glorious freedom fighter into a violent tyrant who has just disgraced Africa by stealing an election by murder and intimidation should not be defended.
The fact that white rule in Zimbabwe was colonial exploitation does not justify the evil Mugabe is now doing and destrying his own hard earned reputation in the process.
Mugabe however is the direct result of the stupidity of Iain Smith and the cabal that stopped Britain setting Zimbabwe independent. Smith and his cronies could not see the march of history and declared UDI to stop majority rule and they then plunged the country in many years of an unneccesary  war in which many thousands, black and white, died and during which race relations were destroyed for generations.
Other East African countries enjoyed peaceful transitions because the colonists saw their time was up and they settled for being part of the new nation. Even the hated apartheid regime in S. Africa saw the writing on the wall and gave in to the relentless movement of history. But not the white fools of Rhodesia (Zimbabwe).
Moderate Zimbabwe politicians were forced out by the turmoil and Smith and his henchmen provided the conditions which brought the freedom fighter to the fore.
However history also teaches us that "freedom fighters" make poor politicians and don't much like handing over the power they fought for in a democratic system,
It is to be hoped that the wise words coming now from the S African government will have the effect of starting anew the democratic process in Zimbabwe.

[EMTL]

First point
The foolish people suggesting this didn't live in Scotland so don't know Scotland so that's why they came up with the silly idea in the first place.
I didn't say "fabricated". The story wasn't but it was so daft and ridiculous none of the serious media headlined it - only scurrilous right wing tabloid rags.
Second point
The whole matter of terrorism is not funny, so stop treating it like a joke.

Assalamu alaikum,
Dave.... same old Dave who enjoy calling people names.

Take it or leave insha Allah Islam shall become the most popular religion not only in Europe but all over the World.

[Dave_McEwan_Hill]

Hello
EMTL
What has your post got to do with anything I have said?

[Jack Fulcher]

Gee, King, you sure get going on this "black vs. white" issue, don't you?  I'm glad Dave jumped in and gave some perspective on this Mugabe character. 

First, we should dispose of this "educational spending" disagreement we seem to have.  From the figures I have seen, educational spending has risen every year since I was a kid (a couple of centuries ago), adjusted for inflation.  If you go to this chart issued by the US Department of Education you'll see this:  http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d07/tables/xls/tabn171.xls
You need an Excell Spreadsheet program to look at this chart, but it shows that, starting in 2003, total educational real (inflation adjusted) expenditures per pupil for K-12 went from $10,423 to $10,561 in 2004 to $10,725 in 2005, the last year they have complete data.  Expenditure per pupil has gone up between 1% and 3.4% per year for the past decade.  In no year did it drop.  You hear a lot of squealing from the teachers' unions, but when they complain about education cuts, they're talking about cuts in the proposed increases, not cuts from last year's expenditures.  This is what makes this such a campaign issue for politicians - people don't have the patience to go over a chart like this, so they do as you apparently have done - just repeat slogans.  Education is a "motherhood and apple pie" issue here, as you know.  No one wants to look like they may be "hurting the kids" with lower education expenditures, so they all stay away from the difficult details in the budget and repeat slogans.  A budget is a very political document and people should look at their own country's budget to get an idea of how the money is being spent.

And yes we would spend more on domestic problems if we spent less on the war (by definition), but this is the eternal "guns vs. butter" argument.  The more we spend on guns the less we spend on butter.  OK.  But if we just stop the war, withdraw and ignore the middle east, as you seem to think we should do, who will stop the islamofascists from taking over Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, Syria, and other countries in the region?  You?  I haven't heard you once say that it's wrong to riot over some silly cartoons, killing Muslims in the process.  I haven't heard you say that Muslims should stand up and say it's wrong to kill young mothers like Amina Lawal for adultry.  I haven't heard you say it's wrong to kill someone for writing a book.  Until Muslims come forward and say that this is going too far, someone else will have to do that work for them.  We already hear islamofascists saying that they're going to reconquer Spain and the rest of southern Europe (check out the clips on MEMRITV.org).  Where are the moderate Muslims like yourself on this issue?

And just to be clear, I think Charlie Crist is a jerk and I also think we're throwing too many kids in jail in this country.  Building more prisons is a huge mistake, in my opinion, and we'll suffer for it.  The war on drugs has been a failure and we need a saner policy that doesn't throw addicts in jail.  I'm very much a Libertarian on this issue.  (And yes I inhaled in college.)

You spend a lot of energy railing against what my ancestors did to your ancestors a few centuries ago.   Oh, good grief!  In the first place, my ancestors were poor farmers still in Europe when all this slavery was going on.  They couldn't afford an Ox, let alone a slave.  But you're really wrong when you describe all of this bad behavior as a "white problem."  This is historically how powerful people behave towards powerless people.  Isn't the history of Africa (before the white devils landed) one of tribal battles and the powerful enslaving the powerless?  Where did the white slave traders get their slaves?  For the most part, they bought them from black Africans.  Or they hired Africans to go out and get them.  There's apparently slavery still existing in Africa (and all over the world if we're to believe some of the Amnesty International stories in the newspaper). 

One issue in the US is one of reparations (sp?) where the descendants of slaves want compensation for the uncompensated labor of their ancestors.  That's fine with me, as long as they give back to us the difference in wealth they enjoy in this country compared with what they would have had if they had stayed in Africa.  The African American has to face some hard realities regarding their ability to create wealth compared with other immigrants.  Racism no doubt explains much of this difference, but not all of it.  This is one of the refreshing things about Obama.  He's not Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson, who have become simply complainers and professional victims, extorting money from corporations so that he won't tell the media how bad they are because only 5% of their employees are black, compared with a black workforce of 15%.  This is shameful; however, Obama hasn't taken this path (although his wife looks like she might) and he might be a positive influence on our culture if he wins the presidency.  Even if he loses, this will be a good experience for us.

The only thing I'd like to add to Dave's good contribution about Mugabe is that I don't care about the colors of the old and new owners of the farms.  The problem is that their productivity dropped precipitously, by any measure you'd like to use, and as a result inflation in the country is 913% per year and continues to rise.  Consumer goods are scarce and are sold on the underground market.  Harare is a basket case and suffers from rolling electricity blackouts.  This is not something made up by the "white press."  No matter how angry you are about what those horrible colonialists did, you should face reality and do something about that tyrant.  He gives ammunition to those racists here and elsewhere who say that Africans can't govern themselves.  I don't believe that, and neither do you.  You don't need to paint your face white (like Michael Jackson), just stand up and do the right thing.  Remember Julius Nyerere in Tanzania?  I remember studying about him when I was in school.  He was well respected in this country as a great leader and educator.  Where are the Nyereres of today?

Not everything is a great white media conspiracy, King.  And, while it's comforting to be a victim, because you're no longer responsible for your decisions, and while it is easy and convenient to blame those dirty colonialists for everything bad, it's not productive in the long run.  You've got to be adult about this and take responsibility for your life.  Study hard and work hard sounds pretty old fashioned, but in the long run it's the only way to build a good life for yourself.

Speaking of work, I need to get back to it.  I'm at home but we just got a new computer.  This monster is so fast I just love typing on it.  It's amazing how fast they're making these things now.  3GB in the RAM.  Good grief!!  Jack

[GoodFella]

I wanted to always respond to such an informative threads but am afraid if I can write too much. So just keep it up guyzzz!!!

[alkanawi]

Fascinating stuff in this thread.Really, really,amazing.I saw the joke in the initial post straight away and i was having a good laugh,shaking my head and muttering"youthful overzealousness"but hey,thats nothing new.Then all of a sudden the thread started getting heated,tempers flaring,allegations and counter allegations were being thrown.The stuff thriller books are made of:terrorists,tinpot dictators,attempted as well as successful assasination of presidents,confessions by ex government agents.The postings take the reader from mexico to fareast with stop over in california,scotland,and Africa.
It is a must read for all those who have been perplexed by the activities of "the global police".
Rating:4 star