Northern Stars!!!!

[Anonymous]

Mista or na misis Southener u bi. I no dey dream, if na dream I no go fit put this. (*hiss*) My firen comments like yuwa misinterpretation make me wanna by concentrated hydrochloric acid & pour it on ur face. ?:P

B u a muslim, a christian, hindu, Buddhist, Jewe whether u worship, Harikrishna, Messiah, Jesus, Allah ?it dont matta. Because obviously when it cumz down 2 religion every religion takes theirs 2 b d best. And 2 me religion is by no means a proper subject of conversation in a mixed company. ?

Ha ha ha hehehe hohohee:(that goes for the acid bit)

That is so real & so true Ummita. I agree with every statement. Ok let by-gone b by-gone. About Isiomas issue. Hey Ummita! I taught Isy the thisday writer went to the same uni you did?  :-X :-X

[lionger]

Mista or na misis Southener u bi. I no dey dream, if na dream I no go fit put this. (*hiss*) My firen comments like yuwa misinterpretation make me wanna by concentrated hydrochloric acid & pour it on ur face. ?:P

Say u get a muslim............which of course wont b soooooooo ill mannered 2 post up a topic sayin............4 xample...... pope john paul would definately choose a wife among d contestant.

As a patriotic beliver wat wud u du? Du u xpect us 2 sit down fold ur hands & ignore such disrespect?

Talkin about editor or writer they r all birds of d same feathers wat makes a writa: makes an editor.

Murder: u call it murder yeah ryt: that y I c yrs bck durin d Kaduna riot: non of d non-muslims committed murder!!!!! ::) Well I wont call it murder: rather every1s fightin 4 justice with is a truth in action.

Even in Bible Exodus: it says: eye 4 an eye,tooth 4 tooh so....if a muslim shud make any provocatice statement then of course a non muslim can seek justice. Well any person lookin 4 justice 2 those that did him/her wrong will see it as a threat bcuz injustice anywhere is a threat 2 justice everywhere.

So tryin 2 seek justice on whether na repoter abi na editor or writa has indeed caused threat which broke in2 violence & then riot........
Oga or na madam southerener, I du respect ur comments but wat u r sayin here is either part of a solution or part of d problem. Wat is done has already been done, lets put behind all that has happened. B u a muslim, a christian, hindu, Buddhist, Jewe whether u worship, Harikrishna, Messiah, Jesus, Allah ?it dont matta. Because obviously when it cumz down 2 religion every religion takes theirs 2 b d best. And 2 me religion is by no means a proper subject of conversation in a mixed company. ?

i am not southerner but anyways - not all christians believe in the pope that much, but a good christian (like a good muslim, i'm sure) would never resort to violence in response. in the book matthew of the bible jesus refutes that verse in exodus u quoted, by saying' love your enemies, and do good to those who persecute you.' yea they might protest it peacefully, but i'm sure a riot scenario would never have occured as a result of that kind of statement. that sort of thing could only happen in Northern Ireland!

there is a big difference b/w an editorial article and others, however that does not excuse the paper's poor judgement. i doubt those rioters even read the article, and thus i seriously doubt the riot had much to do with it. if so, then why the burning of churches? beauty contests are not a christian thing. lastly, we've been holding local pageants in nigeria for how many years now and something like this never happened. there's a lot more to the riots than meets the eye. and until that hidden factor is checked, unfortunately it will happen again. so it might be a good idea to put the whole thing behind us and move on, but then the government had better so some investigation if not, they will be making apologies to the rest of the world again later.

[Blaqueen]

Lord have Mercy!!!!!!

[Ummulhuda]

SA'ADU ZUNGUR!!!!
DAN MARAYA!!!!!!!!
LATE ?MAMMAN SHATA!!!!!


Sa'adu Zungur was a political activist in pre independence era, (I regret not reading anything about him) and a literary giant. Triumph Publishing House as you all know is named after him.
Dan Maraya and Shata believe it or not are internationally reknowned figures. I think (though I may be wrong) that BOTH have been the subject of foreign literary works at some time or other in the past.

FyneDyme asks whether Abacha or IBB qualify as Northern Stars? Personally, I am uncertain when it comes to IBB, but where Abacha is concerned, I think he qualifies. In despite of his ?perceived shortcomings, he really TRIED where Nigeria was concerned. I believe he had the genuine interests of Nigerians at heart. Remember he actually CURBED inflation during his tenure.He stabilized the pendulous forex market, regularly serviced our debts so that we ?could get out of that quagmire as quickly as possible. The official rate of exchange of the Naira to the Dollar became at par with the black market exchange rate. This helped in undermining a lot of shady businesses.
When the West declared him and Nigeria as outcasts, he did a metaphorical ?"UP Yours Too!" and turned Nigeria's attention towards the Far East. He became interested in tangible worthy projects like rejuvenating the railway system. This alone if it had been achieved would have ?revolutionized the socioeconomic climate. We could have had the cheapest transportation system, for both humans and bulk cargo. Travelling would have been easier and faster. Nigeria would have been opened up to a lot more ppl. ?There would be less traffic accidents. Overhead costs in cargo transport would be drastically cut, many more different types of goods would have become more available at a cheaper price. You can think of a lot of other benefits that Nigerians will reap.
But of course, no man is an island by himself and the same goes for the late Sani Abacha. Thus Abacha was surrounded by a lot of ppl who were not as nationalistic as he was and were out to serve their self interests. Haba Jama'a! We all know the Nigerian mentality of looking after number ONE and to the blazes with all else! The Hausa idiom/adage or whatever (grammarians correct me please), 'Ba 'a mugun sarki sai mugun bafade' was very very true in the case of ?Abacha.
I have always maintained that a lot of the atrocities that occured during Abacha's tenure, did so independent of his knowledge of them, after all Only Allah S.W.T. Is All Omnipotent, All Pervasive and All aware. And Abacha became a very sick man towards the end of his life, which was a perfect excuse to keep him incomunicado with many things around him and this sickness eventually provided a perfect alibi for his mysterious death. ?

[Anonymous]

Assalamu Alaikum wrt wbkt

New to the list, Just wanted to add

Abubakar Gimba (Last i knew , was Director at Union Bank, dont know if hes still there). A Prolific writer and novelist

[lionger]

lol i must be dreaming. Abacha as a Northern star? you might as well include 'evil genius' IBB then! Abacha is one of the worst men to ever rule Nigeria. if you understand the important of social development as well as economic development, you learn that by destroying the social stability of Nigeria he created irreparable damage to the entire economy. He nearly wiped out the middle class, the engine of any modern economy. That's partly the reason why 80% of Nigeria professional class now reside in Europe and America.

Was he really acting in Nigeria's interests when he wrested government from Shonekan, and backstabbed MKO? Or when he put to death the Ogoni 9? I hope you can tell me how $4.2 billion ended up in his account, $1.2 billion that has been located in Swiss banks, since Abacha really had Nigeria's interests at heart.

your argument that Abacha curbed inflation is flawed as it does not paint the whole picture. Under Abacha, there was a deliberate attempt to starve States and the Federal Government of revenue they would have used to upgrade their infrastructure, pay salaries, etc.; but they diverted those funds for other personal purposes. Thus there was no money to be spent, meaning no goods were bought, thus inflation was 'curbed'.

the idea that bad company ruined abacha's 'nationalistic' goals, or that the human rights violation that occured during his reign was done without his prior knowledge is laughable; Abacha knew very well what he was doing. Did you know that the exection of Ken Saro-wiwa and the eight other ogoni activists was videotaped and sent to Abacha via Gwarzo for viewing pleasure? How do u explain the fact that all 5 political parties he created chose him as their presidential candidate?
I wonder if you ever saw the disgraceful Abacha-flattering ads that NTA was running during that time in 1998 - 'who the cap fits?', 'who holds the keys to Nigerian progress', and my favorite of all:
A - Adorable
B - Brilliant
A - Admirable
C - Charitable
H - Honorable
A - Affectionate (whatever)..

Anyone who finds this writeup insulting and provocative should first think of how they'd react if i came here and said Adolf Hitler was a good leader since he was able to raise Germany from the ashes of economic disaster caused by the Versailles treaty and the League of Nations.

[nura]

It is not a matter of insult or provocation since you are entitiled to your opinion. I think you cannot equate Abacha and/or IBB with Adolf Hitler. None of them has subjected anybody to the kind of treatment that Hitler metted to Jews, and no sensible human will take Hitler as a hero no matter what economic progress he helped Germany to achieve.

But why do you so hate Abacha an IBB? What have they done that Obasanjo has not done as a military and/or even civilian leader? OR WHAT ABOUT THE FIVE MAJORS? They killed people too and who are the people that abacha killed? remeber that on two occassions there was a coup attempts against his government but the first set of plotters were forgiven, I mean they were not killed we wouldnt have OBJ by now or what do you think. There is still no proof that Abacha has sanctioned the killing of anybody. And what about IBB who was hi victim? Oh I know you are going to say that. The Dele Giwa case has still not been proven in court and the two set of coup plotters were killed by the AFRC not unilaterally by IBB. All i am trying to say is that Hitler is a much bigger evil than Abacha and or IBB if they are Evil or devilish or whatever

[lionger]

It is not a matter of insult or provocation since you are entitiled to your opinion. I think you cannot equate Abacha and/or IBB with Adolf Hitler. None of them has subjected anybody to the kind of treatment that Hitler metted to Jews, and no sensible human will take Hitler as a hero no matter what economic progress he helped Germany to achieve.

But why do you so hate Abacha an IBB? What have they done that Obasanjo has not done as a military and/or even civilian leader? OR WHAT ABOUT THE FIVE MAJORS? They killed people too and who are the people that abacha killed? remeber that on two occassions there was a coup attempts against his government but the first set of plotters were forgiven, I mean they were not killed we wouldnt have OBJ by now or what do you think. There is still no proof that Abacha has sanctioned the killing of anybody. And what about IBB who was hi victim? Oh I know you are going to say that. The Dele Giwa case has still not been proven in court and the two set of coup plotters were killed by the AFRC not unilaterally by IBB. All i am trying to say is that Hitler is a much bigger evil than Abacha and or IBB if they are Evil or devilish or whatever

lol Abumujahid why r u bringing up the five majors and obasanjo? did i say i'm an OBJ fan? i was simply commenting on ummulhuda's comment on Abacha's qualifications as a Northern Star, which i find as insulting to the North and the rest of Nigeria as a whole. I did not intend to directly compare Abacha to Hitler in my last post, nevertheless you don't have to be a Hitler b4 you can be considered a terrible leader. I've already noted the prominent ppl Abacha  executed (ken saro-wiwa). It's not even a matter of how many ppl he he killed compared to the five majors. Till today the government is still trying to recover billions of nigerian taxpayers' money that he scattered all over the world via fake contracts. it bugles my mind as to how abacha can be considered a nationalist.

I was also surprised that umulhuda considers Abacha a star, yet is unsure of IBB. The latter was, to his credit, a very cunning deceptive fox, but institutionalized corruption and did untold damage to the country when he annuled the 1993 elections. If he hadn't done that we would have been spared Abacha's reign. Then again, i guess it doesn't matter since abacha and ibb 'perhaps' stole money and r just saints compared to Adolph Hitler. None of them are saints and that includes OBJ and Buhari and most others. They should all be in jail for massive corruption and human rights violations, instead of being allowed to control the future of this country.

Obviously my experiences in Nigeria during Abacha's and IBB's tenure are very different from yours.The damage they created is out there for the whole world to see, yet some of us are still waiting for God to thunder from heaven and knack us on the head with 'the truth'. If Abacha is a Northern star, then the Five majors are national heros and Kaduna Nzeogwu's birthday should become a national holiday (of course, with all due respects to Sir Ahmadu Bello, Tafawa Balewa and the other unfortunates who lost their lives on account of him and his colleagues)

[nura]

I cant help but to agree with you in respect of IBB, corruption and June 12. You can't be more right, no time in the history of this nation has corruption became a normal thing, a way of life and what is still the bug that's eating our life slowly and steady.

[Ummulhuda]

I still stand by my assertion that Abacha is a NORTHERN STAR! Get it? NORTHERN star not a Nigerian star or a southern star ?or what ever. I don't expect anyone to like Abacha so I am not surprised that you don't, LIONGER. When Abacha took over the reigns of power, Nigeria was in a very bad shape anyway, and he tried to make it better what ever anybody may say. Abacha did not destroy the social stability, he did not destroy the middle class, he was not responsible for the professional brain drain, all those things had already been done by I.B.B! So please give credit or curses where they are due and don't direct them at Abacha.
If states and Federal govt were starved of funds, then the strategy worked in curbing inflation! Be realistic Lionger, you don't honestly believe that the govt functionaries would have upgraded infrastructure? more likely upgraded themselves. As for non payment of salaries, I am not in a position to argue about that because there has never been a month in my working life when I did not receive my salary and on time. Funnily enough, it is under OBJ that I experienced my first payment in arrears!
As for wresting the leadership from shonekan, there was no such thing. The hand that gave Shonekan the lead was the same hand that took the reigns from him and it was not Abacha's hand.

Backstabbing Abiola indeed! Abiola had the worst advisors in the world believe me, for who ever advised him to declare himself as president was his worst enemy. Where on earth have you ever heard a country where a man declares himself President in the face of an opposing and ruling faction and is not arraigned on treasonable charges? I certainly have never done so. Furthermore, Abiola died of natural causes and as an Act of God, he died after Abacha in full view of the western media that the southern press is so fond of. Otherwise his death would have been put squarely on abacha's door step. The fact of his dying from natural causes still did not stop innocent ppl from being killed by a vengeful section of ppl from the southern part of Nigeria. One shudders to think of the scale of genocide that would have occurred, had Abiola died before Abacha!

Ken saro Wiwa and the Ogoni nine were executed because they committed murder, (a chief from his tribe no less correct me if I am wrong). It was even rumoured that there was some cannibalism involved after the murder, and from all indications Ken Saro Wiwa's rabble rousing actions were deliberate and coldly calculated. If Ken Saro Wiwa was not such a well known figure, would there have been the uproar that his execution caused? Remember also it was a time when Nigeria could do no right in the eyes of the West. If Abacha was really that blood thirsty, he would not have hesitated to execute Abiola since he was not a man who put much store in weighing his political options. He acts purely in a military manner.
If Gwarzo made a video of KSW's execution and handed it to Abacha how do you know it was for his viewing pleasure. Isn't it plausible that gwarzo may have just decided to do it and give it as some sort of sycophant behaviour? ?Why would it be pleasurable for a man who has experienced some military action to watch some one's execution on tape. I think Abacha was a better Muslim than that!
As for the sycophancy that went on and resulted in giving new meaning to the term 'Ta zarce', I cannot remember an era in Nigeria's history, (the ones that occurred during my life time that is) when Nigerians in public office or out of it did not embrace sycophancy and nepotism and acted upon them whole heartedly.
In my opinion, the worst leader Nigeria had was Gowon. It was under Gowon that someone made the comment that Nigeria has so much money that we do not know what to do with it! Meanwhile there were the much needed infrastructures which needed to be put in place. At least Kano was very lucky to have had Audu Bako Allah Ya jikan sa. ?It was the same Gowon who gave Bakassi to the Camerounians as a thank you present for something which Cameroun helped NIgeria in (I think it may have been support against Biafra? I can't be sure, I'm too sleepy at the moment), without any formal documentation or anything, and now the spectre of that deed has come to haunt both Nigeria and Cameroun. Abacha wouldn't have done such a stupid. thing as that.

The only flaw that I will not argue with you about is the case of Abacha's billions! That was certainly wrong, but even if he did do the looting, he wasn't alone in it and he certainly couldn't single handedly have looted all that money! You also forget that it was during I.B.B.'s reign that the first Gulf war occurred and because of the phenomenal rise of the price of crude, Nigeria got in the space of a few months in terms of GDP in foreign currency what it normally takes the country a year to earn! What happened to al that money? It wasn't spent during Abacha's era. And for your information, Abacha left so much foreign reserve ( and refused to TOUCH another loan) that by the time AbdusSallam took over, the world bank informed him (AbdusSallam) that Nigeria had so much foreign reserve that the country was ELIGIBLE for another loan! And ?what did abdussallam do? He TOOK it! and brought us back to square one, i.e. indebtedness to the West and a ?downward spiralling Naira, the very sin that Abacha so deftly avoided!
Abacha can never be an Adolf Hitler. But it is a good thing that you mentioned him. Adolf ?may have been an evil genius but he certainly did not perpetrate all those heinous crimes alone. Infact, Hitler has never been near a gas chamber, he has probably never been inside a concentration camp. He concentrated (I like the pun!) on conquering Europe, while he left it to Goebbels to run his propaganda machine and the likes of Himmler and Heydrich to run the S.S. and Gestapo.
Therefore even if a kwai mugun sarki fadawan sa sun fi mugunta! ? ??

[Ummulhuda]

I still stand by my assertion that Abacha is a NORTHERN STAR! Get it? NORTHERN star not a Nigerian star or a southern star ?or what ever.  ?

The sentence should read I still stand by my assertion that...........
I can't correct the sentence in my original submission.

[Ummulhuda]

Hey admin do something about this! Your website's beginning to go round the bend! It produces what it wants not what I want it to produce.
Incidentally, Eid Mubarak while I'm at it! And you can delete these last two posts from this topic if you wish, they are not relevant, once the thing is corrected.

[admin]

Assalamu alaikum;
Ummulhuda and all members,

Sorry about the problem you are having writing some words. I will InShaAllah be working on it as soon as possible.

Also Eid Mubarak and Barka da Sallah to you and to all. I am now in Kanon Dabo right here in the good old Kano, Nigeria (Gari mai Dala da Gwauron dutse. Ko da mai kazo anfika...) I am right here on Konar Sabo Bakin Zuwo just off Maiduguri road not that far from Tarauni. Oh it's so good to be here for Sallah. No any other city celebrates Sallah like it's done in Kano. So Happy Sallah and Eid Mubarak you and to all our ever growing members of this - Kano Online Forum.

?

[lionger]

ummulhuda

i must admit that i laughed a bit while reading your reply.so abacha's islamic faith could prevent him from finding pleasure in the execution of a dissident for obvious trumped up murder charges, yet allowed him to loot the national treasury! LOL! . u tried to make a case for abacha and even hitler! of course they were not alone in their crimes, but does that not in any way rid them of responsibility?

As if sani abacha fell down from the sky in 1993 and became Nigeria's head of state..lol. Wasn't he there during and b4 ibb's time? He was the one who announced on radio buhari's ouster. so he was definitely a willing party to the looting (IBB could't have done it alone, according to your theory). you acknowledge that both IBB and Abacha did steal money, yet Abacha is a star and IBB isn't? Is it because this is kano-online forum, and Abacha was born in kano, whereas IBB is from niger(lol)? And since you do acknowledge that Abacha looted the treasury, how can he still qualify as a northern star?

as for MKO, u may have a point in that he was foolish to declare mandate with abacha at the helm, but he did win the election, didn't he? what legal right did Abacha have to power? I hope you know that detention without trial is a human rights violation, which Abiola endured until he died. Then u say his death was an act of God. lol i shoulsn't even laugh at that statement using God to justify man's wickedness is just too bad. it doesn't matter whether he was directly killed or not.

i guess the worst leader in nigeria's history is debatable but in my opinion, Nigeria shold have been spared every military ruler, perhaps withthe exception of Murtala Mohammed. for this reason the upcoming election like a choice b/w the devil and the deep blue sea. my candidate would be gani.

i must say your defense of Abacha is impressive, however in doing so u're not being fair to yourself, and alll of northern nigeria. there are many other ppl that are definitely northern nigerian icons, and they have been mentioned on this site. including abacha's name doe not at all honor those ppl, or northerners for that matter.

Happy sallah
   

[nura]

I have been avoiding the Abiola issue since I joined this forum but it seems like Lionger has sworn to drag me into it.  Chief MKO Abiola was a Nigerian like no other a good and intelligent man, a very successful businessman and the best philanthropist the nation has ever witnessed. I loved Abiola, in fact I wrote him a letter to beg him to declare for the presidency sometimes I even feel like I'm one of those that dragged him to his death but for my belief in the fact that every soul must taste death and everybody dies at his time. May the AlmightyAllah forgive him and grant him Al janna firdausi amin.

After the annulment of June 12 Election and the emergence of Abacha, Abiola actually gave up and faced his business but was made to renew bid for the mandate by his people knowing trully well that they are sacrificing him to bring Abacha down. Is good to die in the course of progress in fact that is actually what is referred to as Jihad in Islam. The only problem with Abiola's Jihad was he was forced into it. He was not planning for what Gen. Abacha did. One of the biggest misconception then was that Abach was a dunce, a dummy who sleeps at meetings and interested only in night life, so Abacha will handover after taking over from Shonekan.

Initially Abiola was interested in his business and had acknowledge that he wasn't a politician and Abacha was'nt like IBB, he wont give up. My problem with Abiola is why he allowed himself to be tricked into becoming the sacrificial lamb afterall he's not interested in being one and the fact that all those people that were clamouring for him to fight for the revalidation of his mandate ran away after they made him come back. I'm sorry to say this but I think all those NADECO and so called June 12 Heroes are nothing like that, they are just opportunist who used the time and Abiola to make money, name and get political offices. They are now Governors, Ministers, Advisers, Senators, etc in the most corrupt government ever. And funny enough most of them have become a mega Abacha. I'm sorry for the loss of Abiola and I'm feeling it like a true brother.  

In respect of Ken Saro Wiwa to cast Lionger's thought back, I think the man was tried and found guilty of murder and was killed by hanging. His sentence was ratified/confirmed not by Abacha but the Governor of Rivers State. There is still no proof or evidence that Ken did not kill or sanction the killing of the Ogoni 4.

Lionger take it easy Abacha was a good leader may be he needed to protect his throne and had to be mean to his enemies.